Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/MCW Heavyweight Championship/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Matthewedwards 06:02, 31 July 2009 [1].

MCW Heavyweight Championship[edit]

Nominator(s): --WillC 12:43, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Toolbox

I am nominating this for featured list because... a fairy dared me too. Okay, enough with the smartassness, down to business. Leave comments, that is all. I'll fix them and we get another FL, we are all happy then. I have no knowledge of this promotion or its titles. I picked a list, and expanded it. I know enough to get this article finished and correct. Thank you to all those who review.--WillC 12:43, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Needs work. I read the lead only, and these are random points.

  • There's explanatory info in the lead I could have used in reading other wrestling articles, I must say.

I'm guessing that is a good thing.--WillC 11:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • "has held over two-hundred professional wrestling championships in his career, with the MCW Heavyweight Championship being one of those two-hundred"—This is not a good sentence. "more than 200"? Try to avoid the repetition and make the sentence less clumsy.
    • I can remove the entire sentence if you wish? I only included it and the mainstream sentence to make it long enough for a DYK plus for a nomination. I have the DYK now, so the sentence isn't really needed.--WillC 11:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref 1 five times in five lines. Especially in the lead, such reference saturation in every sentence is undesirable. Even down below, try to avoid it.
    • I'll try to fix that.--WillC 11:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "are a few mainstream wrestlers that are former champions"—"who" for people. Tony (talk) 17:04, 8 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The image needs alternative text per criterion 5b. Dabomb87 (talk) 16:39, 10 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • May have been fixed.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Truco
Weak Oppose from Truco (talk · contribs)
General
  • You expanded this article on July 7 and submitted it for FLC the same day, you need to give it some time so other people (like from the respective project) can review the article, it causes stability issues.
  • I somewhat disagree. Most from the project do not even have the indy titles on their watch list. Alot probably do not even know this was expanded to this day. Plus I've created and nominated which isn't much difference and it has never caused a problem.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'd have to agree with Will, he brought it up to the FL format for tables etc and nothing is controversial about this title. So yes it would have been nice to give it a few days but not a requirement. MPJ-DK (talk) 10:05, 13 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Dabs and external links check out fine with the checker tools.
Lead
  • The MCW Heavyweight Championship is a professional wrestling heavyweight championship owned by the Maryland Championship Wrestling (MCW) promotion. -- I would remove the heavyweight from professional wrestling heavyweight championship because there is no such division in the promotion and is rare in professional wrestling in general.
  • I didn't say division. It is still a heavyweight championship either way. So that sentence is still correct and fine.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I can see why, but the World Heavyweight Championship link is correct and incorrect. It is not a world champion yet. Plus sometimes the heavyweight belt is not the top title, though that doesn't have much to do with this at the moment.--WillC 20:00, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • In 2003, MCW closed down operations, however, at its last show appropriately named MCW Last Dance on July 16, the MCW Heavyweight Championship was unified with the FTW Heavyweight and the MEWF Heavyweight Championships, when then-MCW Heavyweight Champion Danny Doring defeated Romeo Valentino and Chris Chetti. -- 1)closed down --> ceased 2)Were Valentino and Chetti the FTW and MEWF champions?
  • Done and yes. Valentino was the MEWF Heavyweight Champion and Chetti was the (ECW) FTW Heavyweight Champion. Noted.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC
  • Can you word that bit better so the reader can understand they were champions.--Truco 503 19:30, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Already done.--WillC 20:01, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • MCW later reopened and held its first show on October 1, 2005 titled Fort Meade Wrestling. --> MCW reopened in [insert date here] and held its first show on October 1, 2005 titled Fort Meade Wrestling.
  • The MCW Heavyweight Championship was revived on March 26, 2006 at MCW's The Phenomenal Final Four event, where Julio Dinero won a tournament to become the first champion since the revival of MCW. -- 1)revived --> reinstated 2)where Julio Dinero won a tournament to become the first champion since the revival of MCW. (no need for the redundancy)
  • Overall, there have been 23 reigns shared between 14 wrestlers. --> Overall, there have been 23 reigns among 14 wrestlers.
  • Of the 14 wrestlers who have held the MCW Heavyweight Championship, such names as Orlando Jordan, Jerry Lawler, and King Kong Bundy are a few mainstream wrestlers that are former champions.[1] Lawler, who is nicknamed "The King", has held over two-hundred professional wrestling championships in his career, with the MCW Heavyweight Championship being one of those two-hundred. -- I see no need for this and I see it more as WP:TRIVIA than anything else.
List
  • Key: It should be ordered in the order that the columns are.
  • Try centering the refs in the Notes column and see how that looks.
  • I did, but it doesn't look very good. So I removed it.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Maryland Championship Wrestling officially reopened in February 2006. Dinero defeated Genesis in a tournament final to win the newly revived title. -- Use the acronym here or don't link MCW, its redundant. 2)I see no need for officially
  • Done, but the history of MCW is contradicting. On their site, they list the October 1 show as one of their's. Then the next event is supposed to be their resurrection in February 2006. So the officially is somewhat needed. I'm not sure which one is the official reopening, so I guessed the MCW Resurrection event on February 25, 2006 is it.--WillC 05:25, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Okay, fine by me.--Truco 503 19:30, 12 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Maryland Championship Wrestling closes down and the championship is unified with the FTW Heavyweight and the MEWF Heavyweight Championships after Doring defeated Romeo Valentino and Chris Chetti. -- 1)closes down -> ceases operations 2)Comma before and the championship 3)Since Doring is mentioned by his last name, do the same for Valentino and Chetti.
References
  • The work field should be Marlyand Championship Wrestling while the publisher needs to be WNW, Inc. for the MCW refs--Truco 503 17:45, 10 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support -- Previous issues resolved/clarified; list now meets WP:WIAFL.--Truco 503 03:20, 15 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 16:43, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)
Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)
  • "In 2003, MCW ceased operations, however, at its last show appropriately named MCW Last Dance" Remove "however" and "appropriately" (it's not our responsibility to determine how appropriately named a show is)
  • "then-MCW Heavyweight Champion" Use an en dash in this situation: "then–MCW Heavyweight Champion"
    • Fixed. I got to start remembering en and em dashes. We go through this everytime.--WillC 23:39, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "MCW's The Phenomenal Final Four event, where Julio Dinero won a tournament to become the champion." "won a tournament" implies that several took place during that event. Is that the case?
  • Image caption needs a period at the end.
  • "All title changes happen at live events"
  • There are double periods in the Marlyand Championship Wrestling refs.
  • "reigns with the exact same number mean that they are tied for that certain rank." Dabomb87 (talk) 23:08, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sources look good. Dabomb87 (talk) 23:08, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Giants2008 (17–14) 22:06, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comments –
  • Hyphen instead of dash for "then–MCW".
    • Just saw that this was covered in a hidden comment. I always thought we were supposed to use hyphens in such situations. Has this changed recently, or have I been wrong all along? Giants2008 (17–14) 17:32, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Hard to explain. When there's a compound adjective, and one of elements has multiple words, you can use an en dash instead of having to use multiple hyphens ("then–MCW Heavyweight Champion" vs. "then-MCW-Heavyweight-Champion"). Learned about it from Tony1 (talk · contribs). Dabomb87 (talk) 17:37, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comma after October 1, 2005.
  • "The initial champion was Romeo Valentino, who became the champion after defeating Corporal Punishment in the finals of a tournament to crown the first champion on October 11, 1998 at a MCW live event." Champion ... champion ... champion. At least change one of them. Also, "a" should be "an".
  • "The current champion is Ruckus, who is in his first reign as champion." Another redundancy similar to the one above.
  • What makes Online World of Wrestling.com a reliable source? Giants2008 (17–14) 17:30, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Wrestling results are easy to optain, so most sites are regarded as reliable by the project as such. OWOW has yet to be proven fully reliable from my understanding but in this case has been proven enough.--WillC 04:34, 22 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Neutral
Resolved comments from MPJ-DK
  • I'm sorry to be so late to the dance, but I saw some obvious problems that no one seems to have caught
  • It is cool. You never have to review if you don't want too.--WillC 09:09, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • In a recent FL review of mine the use of {{CURRENTMONTHNAME}} {{CURRENTDAY}}, {{CURRENTYEAR}} has been opposed because it basically indicates that this list is always correct, which it won't be the second Ruckus loose the title and you're not here to updated it. The last date the list was actually edited should be used.
      • First, sorry, because as you know I tend to disagree with alot of people on points. Thanks for the info, since I didn't know. But that would be a debatable. First a source would be needed to say Ruckus even lost the title. By the time a ref is presented it could be changed like that. So either way they would be correct for an encyclopedia. I'll change it though to avoid this but first I would like to discuss this.--WillC 09:09, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • The second he loses the title the "correct as of today" is no longer correct, it was pointed out that if I didn't maintain certain mexican title pages how long would it be before they were changed? it could be a while and until then people would look at the page and think "oh he's still the champion" instead of thinking "As of July 16 he was still the champion". One version is correct right now, until he loses the title, the other is correct at all times. MPJ-DK (talk) 11:51, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • I'll just remove the lines completely. It avoids manual updating and not running into this problem.
    • In the main list the following names do not sort correctly: Romeo Valentino, Joey Matthews, Julio Dinero; they sort by first name.
    • Should Headbanger Mosh sort by Headbanger or Mosh?
      • No idea, I usually just sort by first name everytime, that is why there are problems with sorting everytime.--WillC 09:09, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • In the "Reigns" list the following names do not sort correctly: Adam Flash, Christian York, Romero Valentio, Joey Matthews, Danny Doring, Jerry Lawler; they sort by first name as well.
    • No need for a note on "Rank" since there are no two wrestlers with the same reign length.
      • It is still somewhat needed. There are still dumb ips out there who do not understand the numbers. Plus at times the champion has the same number as someone else.--WillC 09:09, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • "dumb ips" comment not withstanding, if it's needed then make it part of the table key instead to make it crystal clear. MPJ-DK (talk) 12:54, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Moved to table.--WillC 07:19, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Sources
    • I am really iffy on the sources used here. Only one of the sources is considered a totally reliable 3rd party source. OWOW is borderline reliable and should only be used as if all other options have been exhausted, if as you state "wrestling results are easy to obtain" then there are a couple of sites proven reliable you could use instead such as pwtorch, f4online, wrestleview. MCW sources are primary and while they're alright in limited numbers six out of nine sources and one out of two general ones is not "limited". Only the Slam Sports really passes without a wrinkle and is that really enough to become a Featured List?—Preceding unsigned comment added by MPJ-DK (talk • contribs)
      • I knew this would come up alot but wasn't sure who would. In this case I'm not sure. I find many mentions of MCW and this title in bios at multiple sites, but none that give direct dates for reigns but the one within the article. While we are still talking about an indy promotion in Maryland, so PWTorch, WrestleView, Figure4, etc do not cover it in depth. I'll search through them though. Probably. Looking at the WWE lists, they are just primarly sourced through and through. We'll see I guess.--WillC 09:09, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • It's a road we've travelled before I know, both ways ;) I'm voicing my concern about the abundance of primary sources to see if anyone else has a problem with it, if it's not considered a problem I'll go with that, I just want to know if I'm the only one that wonders. MPJ-DK (talk) 12:54, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Yeah, I understand. I don't like using alot of primary sources, but in this case I said screw it. I didn't expect to find many so I looked a little then gave up. I'm looking through WrestleView and I'll add any if I find any.--WillC 07:19, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • If no one else objects to this then I'll withdraw my objection to the sources. MPJ-DK (talk) 08:27, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. First off, any article with a picture as sexy as that Jerry Lawler shot at the top automatically gets +5 points. :) But anyways, far better FLC voters than myself have fixed the prose issues, and unlike the United States Tag Title FLC above that I took issue with there's solid sourcing for this article. Nice job! Staxringold talkcontribs 02:31, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks.--WillC 02:51, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Ouch. =]--Truco 503 02:44, 31 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You can't win them all Truco.--WillC 02:59, 31 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{FLC}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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